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Horrifying image of Simon Bridges' face superimposed on Simba's, in the hakuna matata scene from The Lion King
(Design: Tina Tiller)

BooksAugust 17, 2021

It means no worries: a revealing interview with Simon ‘Simba’ Bridges

Horrifying image of Simon Bridges' face superimposed on Simba's, in the hakuna matata scene from The Lion King
(Design: Tina Tiller)

Bridges’ memoir, National Identity, is out this week. Danyl Mclauchlan has questions for the former leader of the opposition.

 

So the first thing I want to call you out about here is the subtitle of the book. It’s “Confessions of an Outsider”. But aren’t you a consummate insider? You’re an Oxford law graduate and crown prosecutor and you were a senior minister. 

Yeah, at a level. I’ve been a member of some of the most exclusive clubs in New Zealand, if you want to put it that way. I mean, I’ve been in the cabinet. So I get that. But what’s also true is that whether you’re an insider or an outsider can be dispositional. It’s how you feel. And I never thought: “I’m going to write a book about being an outsider.” But when I read it back, and when the publisher read it back, it was staring us in the face. Because in the first chapter I’m talking about how I’m not a, quote, real Māori, as many would perceive it. And yet I am Māori. I’m too Māori but not Māori enough. And I’m a westie, I speak the way I do, which gets mocked. Whether it’s not feeling like a real man because I don’t meet a stereotyped idealised view of men in New Zealand. If I can put it as a lawyer, there’s more than enough there to make the case for feeling like an outsider. 

I wanted to ask you about that opening chapter on race. Because you’ve got Barry Soper in there declaring in a column that you’re not really Māori because you don’t have the blood quantum, or whatever, and left-wing Māori MPs insinuating you’re not really Māori because you don’t speak te reo, and because real Māori politicians are Labour. Did writing the book help you think through this stuff? 

Yes. Because I didn’t think about it growing up. I did a bit, because you get your prejudices from your parents, but later on I was busy running. Uni. Law. Standing for parliament. But becoming leader of a big political party forces you to confront some of these things. Because Barry Soper is having a go from one end, Winston Peters from another. You have to work out what you are. And that’s not very comfortable. But I feel more at peace about it today than I ever have. I think a central point of the chapter about race is that I reckon there are hundreds of thousands of Māori in New Zealand who feel the same way I do; that there’s an ambivalence from their past. And they’re not card-carrying tiki-wearing marae-based te reo fluent Labour Party voting Māori. Doesn’t mean we’re not Māori though. 

A crowd of people in suits are welcomed onto a marae
Bridges at Waitangi, 2020 (Photo by Fiona Goodall/Getty Images)

It sometimes feels like the rules around this discourse are kind of improvised. You were the first Māori leader of a major party, and I think if you’d been the leader of the Labour party that would have been seen as a historic achievement, and we would have had this big discussion: are we ready for our first Māori prime minister? But because you were the leader of a right-wing party it just didn’t count for anything. Is that how it felt? 

Yeah. And that grates with me. Because people do want to typecast Māori. And many people doing the typecasting are Māori. We don’t say of Scottish people that if you’re not wearing a kilt and eating haggis every day they’re not the real deal. There are hundreds of thousands who have a similar story to me. And history is what it is: a grandmother, off a marae for reasons of racism or urbanisation – or other reasons that cleverer people can explain better than me – who isn’t too proud of being Māori. And so it’s suppressed. My father was useless and amnesiac about all this stuff. And that’s part of who I am. Now I’m proud of my whakapapa. But I don’t like the typecasting. 

Your book is about identity politics. Is it a critique of the way identity politics as it plays out often has this homogenising, flattening effect, and says “this is your group and you have to just be a generic member of it”? Because what I think you’re saying is that identity functions as a stack. That we all have all these different components to our identity and that makes us unique. 

I think there’s something in that. I hope people are surprised by the book. Because they will have a view of Tories as, y’know, French cuff shirts, banking, corporate, bread and butter … rugby … whatever. Well that’s not me. And let’s forget those typecasts. You can be a vegan – as I am at the moment – and vote for the right. So I do hope that whoever it is that’s reading it will think about their own identity and realise that maybe some of those stereotypes that we paint about New Zealanders aren’t true for them. 

You also write about being introverted. I wrote about introversion in my last book, and now when people come up to me at book festivals they’re very delicate, like I’m a gazelle that might run away if they talk too loudly. And that’s not really how it works. 

No. I’m definitely an introvert. No doubt about that. That doesn’t mean I’m shy. Shyness is a cousin of introversion. I think if you’re an introvert who’s shy you’re right at one end of the spectrum of this thing. But that isn’t me. I’m not at all shy. I’m not scared of people. On a bad day I hate people but basically I like people. I would like to, tonight, go out for a meal with a big group. But at the end of a couple of hours of that I’m totally ready to go. I’m peopled out. I’m de-energised, and I’m ready to go home and read a book. Whereas people like my wife Natalie, or John Key who is at the far end of the extrovert spectrum – they love it. They would still be there at 3am if you let them. Again there’s a stereotype there that your successful politician, particularly on the right, is gonna be uber-extroverted. And it seemed to me that if I was talking about my identity, introversion was a really big part of it. 

Book cover - photograph of a man in cheesy chin on fist pose, smiling benignly
National Identity, out this week (Image: Supplied)

I think people who read this book will say “Simon Bridges is interesting, and also very weird in a way that you totally didn’t communicate to the public when you were opposition leader.” Did you write this book because you felt constrained as leader? 

That’s clearly there. It’s so cliched, isn’t it, but there’s no doubt that some of this is self help. I lost the leadership and started writing the book within six months. And I did want to set the record straight. I wanted people to see the real me. What’s true is that … everyone in this age is looking for authenticity – whatever that is – but I know that when I was leader of the National party, if I put it all out there, if I said I couldn’t be bothered with rugby, and can I go home now and read a book, and I’m insecure about this, that and the other thing … that probably wouldn’t have gone real well. Now I’m just a lot more footloose and fancy free and I can say all that. And I am a narcissist – I say that only because every politician I’ve ever met is. But I genuinely hope that it isn’t all about me. Political leaders come in all shapes and sizes. There is a right man or woman for certain times. This idealised conception of what a political leader should be like is overrated. And there’s so many examples of politicians who don’t fit it, whether it’s Bill English or Barack Obama or Angela Merkel. 

You have a chapter on class. And you talk about your accent, and how some of the mockery of your accent got under your skin. Back in 2018 The Spinoff published a column by the linguist Elizabeth Gordon arguing that what this showed was that New Zealand was not the classless society we liked to think we were. You were being attacked from the left, which is traditionally the party of the proletariat, yet you were being made fun of for having a lower class accent. And you hint that it signifies something important about class and politics, and then you swerve away, and say “And I could go on about that but I won’t.”

There’s a lot of academics writing about this in the US and the UK, at the moment who are right into this. We are part of a profound shift that’s happening all around the world where the right is becoming more working class and the left is becoming more upper professional class, if you want to put it that way. 

The professional managerial class. 

Correct. And it’s a really interesting phenomenon. One thing that’s important to me and the reason I write about class is because … I don’t want to say “Woe is me. I’ve got all these grievances.” I haven’t. Life has been good to me, as you’ve acknowledged. But I don’t think we should say there isn’t class in New Zealand. Even today I think there’s a pretty widely held view that we’re this egalitarian country where everyone can go along to the rugby; where Tom from Remuera and Sally from Ōtara can mix in and rub along. I just don’t know that I believe that any more. Again, I’m not saying “Woe is me” but I do think there’s an irony that I’ve been subjected to this class-based sneering from members of the urban liberal intelligentsia who see themselves as punching up and on the right-side of history and all that, but who are actually functioning as gatekeepers. 

Photo of a middle-aged politician, eyes closed, chin raised, during a press conference bristling with microphones
Bridges speaks to media after a caucus meeting at Parliament on October 16, 2018 (Photo: Hagen Hopkins/Getty Images)

There’s no chapter on ideology. Do you think your religious faith fills the role of an ideology?

Well I’ve deliberately steered clear of capital P politics. This book was not a hard book to write. I sat down and it flowed naturally. From time to time I do steer into some polemical, ideological stuff. The education chapter. Maybe some other bits. But on the whole I was trying to steer clear of that and be more about good old stories and experiences that point to a wider meaning. 

You’re a big reader. What are some books that you’d recommend to Spinoff readers to understand contemporary conservative politics. Or just politics. 

One would be Douglas Murray, The Madness of Crowds. Salman Rushdie’s Languages of Truth. The book I’m reading at the moment that is absolutely amazing is George Saunders’ A Swim in the Pond in the Rain. 

What’s your favourite story in that? Is it The Nose? Everyone loves The Nose. 

I like the one by Tolstoy. Master and Man. And the reason it’s amazing is that someone like me who isn’t a literary scholar can read it and get it and absorb the deeper truths that these great Russian writers are speaking to. I find it to be a very spiritual book. 

There’s not too much about Covid or the leadership coup in your book. You criticised the government during the lockdown, at the height of the prime minister’s popularity, and that made you incredibly unpopular and opened the way for the coup. If you could go back would you change that? 

No, I wouldn’t change much. And I’ll tell you why. Because I would have been stuffed either way. If I’d been quiet I was gone anyway. And I am a deep believer that the opposition’s role is to hold the government to account and go at it. It disappointed me that not many New Zealanders valued that. And I get it, right: we were in a rallying-around phase in relation to a national enemy in the form of Covid. I know that with the Covid committee and the prods we gave them made their response better. But as they say in the Lion King, hakuna matata. I don’t regret it. 

National Identity: Confessions of an Outsider, by Simon Bridges (HarperCollins NZ, $37.99) is available from Unity Books Auckland and Wellington

Keep going!
Exterior view of a prison yard and guard towers, backdrop of native bush
Paremoremo maximum security prison, 20 years ago (Photo by David Hallett/Getty Images)

BooksAugust 16, 2021

Arthur Taylor: What it’s like to be strip searched in prison

Exterior view of a prison yard and guard towers, backdrop of native bush
Paremoremo maximum security prison, 20 years ago (Photo by David Hallett/Getty Images)

In an excerpt from his new book Prison Break, Arthur Taylor explains how strip searches work in prison – and how, three years ago, he pushed back.

A word from Spinoff Books editor Catherine Woulfe:

This is an extremely impressive memoir. It’ll be in the bestseller charts for ages, and maybe even make an appearance at the Ockhams.

Written with Stuff reporter Kelly Dennett, there are moments of vivid descriptive writing – see the start of the excerpt below – as well as rollicking escape yarns, court dramas, strange little love stories; stories about a life spent largely inside prison, or breaking out of them.

It’s not a morally straightforward read. Taylor feints, dodges, winks: there are crimes he’s not been pinned down for and doesn’t intend to be. He’s cagey about his finances. There are crimes he has committed that he doesn’t want you thinking about too much, and has compartmentalised for himself. But then there’s a heartbreaking backstory in which an 11-year-old Taylor is picked up for repeated truancy and carted off to Epuni Boys’ Home. “The unfairness of it came to plague my whole life,” he writes. 

Holding the book together is that sense of a psyche profoundly wronged, and the drive to put some things right – like prisoners being strip searched for no good reason. 

Cover of the book Prison Break, with a head and shoulders selfie of a middle-aged man wearing a camo t shirt and cap, and pounamu.
Arthur Taylor and his memoir (Photo: Supplied)

Take your shirt off and hand it to a guard for them to inspect the cotton. Lift both arms up, overhead. Turn, like a ballerina. Open your mouth, poke out your tongue. Move it up and down. Put your shirt back on. Take off your shorts and underwear. The three guards will inspect these, too.

Lift your penis, your testicles, let their eyes wander over your body. Turn. Squat. You’re bending at the knees until your arse is close to the ground. You’re exposed. They will leer. 

It’s not over yet. Shorts back on as the three guards exit the cell. At the entrance to the landing a group of officers, more than 10 of them, will watch as I’m ordered to spread-eagle against a wall while a portable metal-detector wand is run over my weaponless body. I lift my feet to let the detector be run over the soles of my footwear. Humiliating. Intimidating. Illegal. 

Back in October 2016 while my fight for the vote was going on, three prison officers at Paremoremo were badly assaulted by four inmates in C block, which housed maximum-security prisoners. By this time I’d been moved to the lower-security unit, A block. 

The assault should never have happened. One of the inmates had requested something, and when the officer opened the door to pass the item through, three other prisoners appeared and pushed the door open. Two of them had home-made shanks, and stabbed two of the guards with them. Other screws joined the melee; one officer was carted off to hospital and the other three treated on-site. The inmates had three weapons on them in all, one of which had been made out of a supposedly tamper-proof metal bracket for a television. 

When dealing with maximum-security prisoners, there’s a basic rule to follow: whenever they are out of their cells, you have three officers present for each inmate. You can’t open the door without strict instructions. Sure, these guards had fucked up, but they didn’t deserve to get hurt. Most of the other prisoners didn’t agree with, or condone, the violence.

The guards thought that two of the inmates responsible seemed drunk. A plastic bag of fruit and liquid was recovered. The guards figured that they’d been drinking homebrew, though that was never proven because they never bothered testing the bag for alcohol. (Homebrew, alcohol made from fruit and sugar, is easily made in prisons, though the banning of the yeast-based Marmite stymied this enterprise somewhat. Inmates can have up to nine pieces of fruit in their cell, though, and have a daily ration of sugar.)

Typically, prison manager Tom Sherlock’s instinct was to lock the prison down, which meant that every prisoner was confined to their cell. A few days later, Sherlock decided that every prisoner, including those in the special needs unit but not those in the management and at-risk units, should be searched for evidence of weapons or homebrew. It wasn’t long before three officers marched up to my cell in A block and told me I was to be strip-searched. It was ludicrous. The assailants had nothing to do with us in A block, and it made no sense that I’d be hiding fruit or modified TV brackets between my butt cheeks. I could understand them strip-searching the prisoners that were involved, or even the other ones on their block. But our wing was the farthest you could get from them. 

No matter how much a prisoner argues, front-line staff still carry out their orders. It’s useless trying to deter them. The Corrections Regulations 2005 provide that if a prisoner is aggrieved by a lawful order, then he/she must obey it and complain later. If you refuse to obey an order, it will likely result in you being physically overpowered, and put in painful wrist locks and choke holds. 

So now, these screws were in my cell saying, “We’ve got to do it.”

“No. Listen, you’ve got metal detectors, you’ve got hand-held scanners, you’ve got X-ray machines, you’ve got everything. Why do you need to do a strip-search, and what are you looking for anyway?”

“We can’t tell you, Arthur, we’ve just been ordered to strip you. That’s all we know. We’ve got to do what we are told.”

“That defence isn’t going to wash. When Nazis tried to claim they were only obeying orders for chucking people in the gas chamber, they still got tried at Nuremberg.”

But it was all above their heads. They were just following orders.

I’d been strip-searched dozens of times over the years, but this time there was no rhyme or reason to it and I felt dehumanised and vulnerable. It was akin to someone wandering into your home and ordering you to take all your clothes off. Prisoners have got so few rights and dignities. I try to reinforce their sense of self-worth in the hope that they will respect others. They have to feel good about themselves, to feel that they’ve got some worth and value – but prisons operate to undermine, to tell them they’ve got no rights, to tell them they’ve got no dignity, and it’s extremely counterproductive. 

Strip-searching is a quick way to degrade a prisoner. Prison officers don’t like doing it (although some nasty ones do), and I find it particularly offensive in relation to women. The Canadian courts have likened strip-searching to visual rape. Not too long ago we had a case where 15 women prisoners were paid $25,000 each in compensation for unlawful internal searches. This time, it needed to be reinforced to Corrections: You can’t do this. 

Sometimes you’ve got to draw a line in the sand and whatever the cost you’ve got to fight, even though it’s going to be extremely disadvantageous for you. 

More than 200 prisoners had been searched, and none of those searches produced anything from their persons, although some cell searches did – two shanks, a blade, and a container of homebrew. I wrote to the chief executive of the Department of Corrections pointing out what had happened and explaining to him the relevant law, the relevant section in the Corrections Act. I asked him to take legal advice and said that I was holding him liable, that the prisoners who had been strip-searched wanted an apology and they wanted some monetary compensation. That letter was sent about December.

The strip-search case came before Justice Mary Peters at the High Court at Auckland in March 2018, 18 months after the search. Tui Hartman was my McKenzie friend. 

Tui Hartman was a 32-year-old paralegal living in Ontario, Canada, whose father was a Kiwi. Canada has similar laws to ours, so Canadian law students study a lot of my cases. New Zealand law professors teach them in law school, too. One day she rolled a dice and sent me a Facebook message to ask some questions about the law. She was shocked when I answered her. 

We struck up a conversation, and then we got her telephone number put on my list so we could talk to each other. (As a prisoner, you can only call certain phone numbers that have been approved by Corrections.) We continued to correspond and in January 2018 she moved to New Zealand.

Tui visited me regularly in prison, driving hours each way. She loved the outdoors. We were briefly engaged, but we didn’t marry. The police called her regularly, warning her off, so I said, “You can’t be subjected to this sort of nonsense – we’d better split up and have a bit of distance for a while.” She ended up working for the police in a data-entry job. We’re still in touch. 

It was a rather unusual relationship, but these things happen. There’s no accounting for matters of the heart. 

Even though it was short-lived, my romance with Tui attracted a lot of attention. I didn’t mind, because I like to be an open book. I’m on Facebook all the time, which people think is unusual. I say, if I was in the underworld – and that’s why it’s called the underworld, because you fucking keep everything secret – I wouldn’t want you knowing where I am and what I’m doing. Instead, I’m open all the time. But that still doesn’t change the way the police or Corrections behave. They’ve got certain things lodged in their heads and they’re determined to prove them right no matter what.

In this case, Phillip John Smith and I had joined action to complain that the search was unlawful, unreasonable, in breach of the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act 1990, and inhumane and undignified. We wanted a declaration that the search was unreasonable and sought compensation of $10,000 each. 

I love cross-examining Corrections staff because they’re not used to having to justify themselves. Once you get them on the stand and are asking “Well, why did this happen – what’s your statutory justification for this?” they can’t answer. Here’s a snippet of my cross-examination with old Sherlock. 

“At the time you ordered the search of both Mr Smith and myself, the strip-search, not the search of ourselves, the strip-search of our person, you had no information whatsoever that suggested we were in possession of any weapons or items that could be used to make weapons?”

“No.”

“At the time you ordered the strip-search of myself and Mr Smith, did you have any information whatsoever that Mr Smith or myself were in possession of any unauthorised items?”

“No.”

“Did you give any consideration, whatsoever … as to myself and Mr Smith’s individual circumstances before you ordered that strip search of us?”

“As individuals, no.”

This was significant. We argued that the search was unlawful because there was no belief that either Smith or I had an unauthorised item in our possession, let alone a belief held on reasonable grounds. 

It took two years from the event itself, but in September 2018 Justice Peters ruled that the strip-searches were unlawful, unreasonable and a breach of the Human Rights Act. Those who had joined me in the action, including Phillip John Smith, were paid $1000 each. 

I’ll tell you a story about Phillip John Smith, convicted of molesting a child, then murdering the child’s father, before escaping to Brazil while on temporary release. When he came back from his little stint in South America, the word went around prison that you could virtually kill him with impunity and the authorities wouldn’t care. To me it looked like they had transferred him to where someone could get at him. 

I had to put a stop to this chatter about knocking him off, because he was a very smart cookie. I had received 100% assurances from him that he would never re-offend in that manner again. My choice was either to go along with the screws’ propaganda, or identify Phillip’s good points that could be used for the common good of all prisoners. When they saw that he was working with me on the strip-search case, all the heat came off him. Those strip-searches might well have saved his life.

Prison Break: The extraordinary life & crimes of New Zealand’s most infamous escapee, by Arthur Taylor with Kelly Dennett (Allen & Unwin, $36.99) is available from Unity Books Auckland and Wellington